"He is not going to be able to drive..."

Mark,

Well, M______ we thought has been behaving better. We did have to take away driving privileges several times as a consequence, and I had to thwart his leaving with a friend once (he was confined to the house/yard), but for several days he was following our rules as far as we could tell. We had been told in June by A_______ Mom (the ex-girlfriend) that our son was not to contact her daughter in any way. We know they have still been together and talking to each other even though we told M______ we wanted the Mom to "OK" this and then we would have no problem with them seeing/talking to each other. He states "she will never call you".

In the interim, I put a blocker on his ex'es phone so no incoming calls come through, and he agreed to not contacting her for 2 weeks so he could be allowed to drive. Well, today, we found out that he lied. He was supposed to stay home and to be watching his little brother. Called and asked if his friend and two girls could come over (a new girl who seems very nice and her friend). We said OK but had to stay in the family room and his brother would be present and NO inappropriate behavior (only over for about 1 hr). Well, girls never came over. He had permission to drive to work later in the afternoon, which he did (I gave him the car keys when I came home.)

After he left for work, this new girl K_____ called for him. She was upset. She proceeded to tell me that M______, his ex-girlfiend and another girl met her at a local fast food restaurant near the Mall (with my 9 yr old present). K_____ got into the car. He was driving his buddy's car (the friend was at football) as the car M______ uses was parked and I had the keys, and he did not have permission to drive. We do not allow him to be driving another's vehicle and he is only allowed one passenger. This ex proceeded to assault K_____. She escaped from the car and walked/ran back to the Mall where she had been shopping. She feels she was "set up" as A_____ has been threatening to meet up with her to beat her up. My 9 yr old admitted that this assault did happen. He was crying when he admitted it as he was threatened by M______ not to tell. He further stated they drove home, and the other girl then took over driving the friend's car and the girls left. Now I'm waiting for M______ to come home from work to confront him about this.

Obviously, he is not going to be able to drive. He did sign a driving contract which is very strict. He will also be confined to the house/yard for a while. I would like to know your opinion on how long you feel is appropriate. Sometimes I feel that 3 days is not long enough, doesn't "hurt" enough as it only takes a few days (certainly only a week at the best) for him to be "consequenced" again. Also, he is supposed to watch the 9 yr old again on Thursday--would you trust him?

Just so you know, I am taking care of myself. I no longer feel trapped at home to make sure he is home--I'm letting him face consequences. Thanks for being there!

J.

__________

Hi J.,

Would I trust him? No. Trust is earned. He would have to earn my trust by following through with expectations. Then, and only then, is trust extended.

Re: length of consequence. If you go more than 7 days, he’ll forget what he’s being grounded for and the lesson will be lost. 3 days works best, because it gets the child “back in the game” as quickly as possible.

Think of it this way: When a basketball coach has a player that gets into a fight with a member of the other team, the coach doesn’t suspend his player for the season – he doesn’t even “bench” him for the entire game. Instead, he makes his player sit on the bench for only one quarter.

Why? Because not being able to play for one entire quarter feels like an eternity to that player. If he’s kept out of the game any longer than one quarter, resentment builds and his sense of devotion to the team wanes.

The idea behind disciplining a teen (whose brain is not fully developed yet, and who does not perceive the passage of time the same way as an adult) is to issue the consequence immediately (i.e., here and now), consistently (i.e., he gets a consequence EACH TIME he violates a house rule), and short-term.

You want him to get “back in the game” as soon as possible so he can, in a sense, make more mistakes -- this is how he learns, and this is how he finds ways to adjust his attitude and behavior.

Mark Hutten, M.A.

==> Effective Disciplinary Techniques for Defiant Teens and Preteens

When One Parent Sabotages the Other

"Mark, You mention that it is better to have a weaker discipline strategy from both parents than a stronger strategy from one, but what if one parent will not discipline the child and goes behind your back to replace items you have withdrawn. This parent encourages the child to lie and be deceitful as he practices these traits and encourages the child not to tell Mom. We are close to divorce, but both desire the best for the child, but we see the best very differently. Some of these difficulties are exaggerated by our ages - I am 57 and he is 78; our son is 12."

At one of our recent parenting seminars, one member worried aloud that she and her husband disagreed about how to raise and discipline their 13-year-old son. She pointed out that she and her husband came from different family backgrounds, so the examples they had grown up with were very different. She wondered if they could ever agree about child rearing, and she was concerned that their son was not be receiving consistent rules from both parents. "How can we begin to come to some agreement?" she asked.

Throughout the room, heads nodded. It can be a big problem -- joining two people who have been raised by very different methods and expecting them to be in harmony about how to raise their own children. When people are falling in love and considering marriage and families, they usually don't think to ask, "Are you a passive parent …an authoritarian … a neglectful parent …or assertive?”

One of the biggest sources of marital stress is disagreement about child rearing. And for children, major parental disagreement is a source of mixed messages and confusion that may undermine the attitudes, values, and behaviors parents hope to teach. Whatever the nature of the disagreement, it can have a significant impact on all family members and can lead to an erosion of parental authority, as children learn to play one parent against the other.

If the children are still young, parents have time to negotiate some agreement about the major aspects of child rearing:

1st- Sit down together and list the aspects of child rearing on which you DO agree (e.g., what goals do you have for your child, say by the time he is 15, and what values do you want him to learn?).

2nd- Identify the standards of behavior that you agree are realistic for your child's age.

3rd- List any strategies you both think are important (e.g., you may disagree about punishments, but you may agree that both parents should set an example of respect and honesty; you may agree that it's important to tell him you appreciate it when he does what you ask).

4th- After you've identified points of agreement, begin to list areas of disagreement. Talk openly, calmly and respectfully about what you each believe regarding how your child should be parented -- and where you learned those beliefs.

5th- Identify child-rearing sources to which you can turn, understanding that together, you may need to learn new strategies to replace the old ways that are a source of conflict.

6th- Agree to a regular time to check in with each other about how you're doing together as parents. Give new strategies a chance to take hold and give your child a chance to learn that mom and dad are working together. Do not expect your child's behavior to change immediately, just because you are trying a new mutually agreed upon tactic.

Mark Hutten, M.A.

 

==> My Out-of-Control Teen: Help for Parents

Disneyland Dad: The Fly In The Ointment

Hi Mark, This weekend K is grounded. He asked his father to take him to soccer and his father did. (while his father lives with us I am in many respects a single mother and my husband is not interested in joint parenting). In fact my husband actively works against me. Anyway, now K says he doesn't care if he is grounded - he will get his father to take him. His father will buy him another phone if I confiscate it again. The only option I see is to say that the grounding stands and he must start it again and until he serves his grounding I will not take him anywhere. I would appreciate any thoughts you may have. ~ V.

````````````````````````````````

Hi V.,

Re: The only option I see is to say that the grounding stands and he must start it again and until he serves his grounding I will not take him anywhere.

You hit the nail right on the the head. When a child is grounded, but Disneyland Dad (i.e., the fly in the ointment) undermines the consequence, then mom simply restarts the clock when the child returns home.

For example, mom says her child is grounded for 3 days with no computer privileges. Disney Dad shows up and takes the kid to the carnival and buys him 3 lbs. of cotton candy, 2 stuffed toys, and one foot-long hot dog. Kid returns home (totally over-indulged and sick to his stomach) ...the clock starts again as soon as he walks in the door.

Be sure to let your son know that HE is the one extending the time-frame when he leaves with dad prematurely -- not you.

Also bear in mind the a weaker parenting plan supported by both parents is much better than a stronger one supported by only one parent.

Mark Hutten, M.A.

 

==> JOIN Online Parent Support

Do not try to fight 4 battles at once!

Mark, 

What do I do when I've issued the 3-day-discipline (e.g., for violating curfew), but then my son creates a new problem before completing the discipline (e.g., calls me a "bitch", then breaks a plate by throwing it in the sink too hard)? Do I start the 3 days over even though the "broken plate episode" is unrelated to the curfew violation, or does this new problem get a different consequence?

````````````````

Hi T. 

You only restart the 3-day-discipline if the original crime is re-committed (in this case, if your son violates curfew again).

When parents issue a 3-day-discipline, it is very common for kids to introduce additional behavioral problems (temper tantrums, threats, etc.) as a way to (a) get the parent side-tracked from the original consequence and (b) get the focus off of them and onto the parent's anger.

If the parent falls for this, she ends up issuing additional consequences on top of existing consequences, restrictions against the kid begin to pile up, and before long, the kid is grounded for 3 months with no privileges -- and both the parent and the kid have forgotten what the original problem was.

Don't let this happen to you. Do not let your son get you distracted from the original problem and the associated consequence for that problem. Here's how you do this:

If your son commits another "crime" (figuratively speaking) during a 3-day-discipline, put this new crime in the "Deal-With-It-Later" file. You literally write the problem down on a piece of paper (e.g., 'son called me a bitch and broke a plate') and put this note-to-yourself somewhere where you can find it after the original 3-day-discipline is completed.

After the original 3-day-discipline is completed, you then confront your son regarding the second problem he introduced by saying, "Just for your information, in the future, if you choose to __________ (in this case, "call me a bitch and break my dishes"), then you'll choose the consequence which is __________ (here you just follow the strategy "When You Want Something From Your Kid" in the Anger Management Chapter of the Online Version of the eBook).

So, does your son get "off the hook" for calling you a name and breaking a plate? In a way, yes -- but only for the time being. He will have to answer to you if the name-calling and plate-breaking occur again in the future.

Pick your battles carefully - but perhaps more importantly, pick them one-at-a-time. Do not try to fight 4 battles at once. You'll just blow a blood vessel in your brain, and your kid will be successful at getting you to chase your tail.

Use your "Deal-With-It-Later" file frequently. You'll save yourself a lot of time and energy that would otherwise be spent in chronic power struggles.

Q: How do you eat an elephant?

A: One bite at a time.

Mark Hutten, M.A.

 

==> My Out-of-Control Teen: Help for Parents

Therapy Ain't Workin'

Mark, Thank you for the recent report on ODD and ADHD. There is no question that this is what my son suffers from. We were assigned to AB3632 last year. He was almost expelled and having a lot of issues at school. We started a med last April, which has really made a difference in school. He is 13 almost 14. He is in SDC at school and is having a much better year behaviorally then last year. We are still struggling at home, but there is some improvement. The more structured and busy he is the better. Summer will be a little more difficult, but we are making plans to keep him as busy as possible.

We have 2 hours of services available each week through the AB3632 program. They continue to do "therapy" and my son is frustrated and refusing to go. For him it is a waste of time and I can't disagree. The therapist has not been able to make a connection with him. We were doing behavior modification, which was having some impact, but that person left the program. Now they have assigned a drug/alcohol counselor also. I think they were hoping as a male he could connect. Both are trying to engage him in talk therapy and failing. I have spoken to them several times and requested programs for anger-management and skill building …practical things that could help. At this point the therapy sessions are causing him to be more angry and frustrated. Although they agree with me, we continue down the same path. I feel that they are expecting me to make my son want to work with them and I can't do that. You said you deal with the behavior side. What do you suggest? ~ D.Z.

```````````````

Hi D.,

Counseling is just another traditional parenting strategy that has little or no effect. Thus, as you know, you are not making much headway with “therapy” (and maybe making a bad problem worse).

Are you using the strategies outlined in “My Out-of-Control Teen” eBook? If so, do you have a specific question regarding how to implement any particular strategy?

If I were you, I would try to find your son a mentor (e.g., a big brother from the Big Brother/Big Sister Organization). He needs someone to talk to “on his level” (i.e., someone who is interested in him as an individual, not someone who is attempting some sort of behavior modification). When I do therapy with a child, he rarely perceives it as a “therapy session” because I recruit him as a ‘partner in problem solving’ – he does the work. You can see an example of a session here ==> The Art of Schmoozing.

None of us know why we behave the way we do, so if a therapist tells the kid that he is doing something for some reason and this is a good reason, the kid is inclined to believe it. If he is angry or negative with the therapist, but the therapist responds with positive reframing (i.e., turning a 'negative' into a 'positive'), then the kid is likely to get confused. Here the kid is trying to be obnoxious and distance himself from the therapist, but the therapist is saying lots of nice things the kid likes to hear!

The difference between how men and women behave can be illustrated by how they deal with an angry dog. A man would say, 'Good dog! Good dog!' while he looked around for a big stick. A woman on the other hand would say, 'Good dog! Good Dog!' until it actually believed it was a good dog! I don't believe that this represents a sex difference --it's just good psychology. When you reframe, you are telling the kid what a good doggy he is until he believes it! And it works. It works because at heart, that's what we all are (i.e., GOOD). No matter how foolish our behavior, our intentions are always good.

Mark Hutten, M.A.

==> JOIN Online Parent Support

`````````````````

Thanks for your response Mark.

This is confirmation on counsel we received from a pastor friend. We are in process of working with our youth leaders to identify a good mentor. Someone in college and closer to Matt's age. I agree that we need to focus on the positives and believe that success is possible. This seems to be more difficult for my husband. He really struggles with the language and impulsive response's from my son. Things like "stupid", "shut up" and "dumb butt".

My husband advised me today that it is more difficult for men than woman to tolerate this type of action. My feeling that he shouldn't tolerate it, but punish him immediately. Maybe we should chat sometime.

D.Z.

Stepsons Steal iPad: Dilemma for a Stepfather

"What would you recommend as a course of action for the following: I have a 15 yr old stepson who admits to having stolen an I-Pad from a car, and a 17 yr old stepson who admits to having sold it to a friend. My gut says call the police, report the incident, and let them deal with the consequences. My wife wants to deal with it 'in house' and keep the law out of the matter. The problem is threefold: (1) Both sons are currently dealing with legal issues (on probation in juvenile court), and reporting the theft would almost certainly guarantee jail time for them. (2) This occurred a couple of weeks ago, and it appears that the whole matter is quietly slipping into oblivion. (3) Reporting the boys has major potential to cause a rift in my marriage. Any suggestions?"

Re: Point #1 – Your wife is not doing anyone any favors by saving her sons from consequences. Obviously, she is not willing to work this program if her attitude is “I need to keep my sons from experiencing painful emotions associated with their poor choices.” Anyway …as a weak alternative (in the interest of avoiding a rift in the marriage), both sons should earn money to replace the iPad and return the new one to the theft-victim.

Re: Point #2 – You’re right ...to issue a late consequence will not have as much of an impact as it would if it were immediate.

Re: Point #3 – Here we have to take a look at how the advantages outweigh the disadvantages. Clearly, keeping your marriage intact is paramount. Without you, the sons have no father-figure. The marriage comes first.

The following is not necessarily a recommendation in the formal sense, but I recently had another “stepfather” that was going through a very similar situation. Somehow, he got an anonymous call through to his stepson’s probation officer, advising him of some illegal activity that the son was engaging in. As a result, the issue was addressed immediately, but without putting the stepfather in the “hot seat” with his wife.

 

==> My Out-of-Control Teen: Help for Parents

Aussie Mum Employs Tough Love

Hi Mark,

Thank you for your emails, I really find your contact to be quite soothing. Although I am unable to put any of the ebook into practice, I have still been studying on your suggested time frame (digesting weekly assignments) and believe quite firmly that this is helping me immensely to understand the problems I have experienced with my daughter.

As discussed in my earlier email, K___ has officially left home but she has invited herself and her family for dinner for the past two Sundays. This move rather surprised me as I thought she would stay away for quite a long time. K___ arranges these appearances with her Dad and only stays for the duration of the meal and is gone within 2 hours. At least I am seeing C___ (my granddaughter) for these brief visits, the poor little bugger doesn't understand any of this. The mood is a tad strained and we basically exchange pleasantries. I keep myself busy in the kitchen and don't initiate any conversations, I answer if I am addressed directly, but really just try to stay out of the way and enjoy my time with C___. J___ (the boyfriend) has never got along with my husband and he hides himself outside smoking and talking to his mates on his mobile, he appears at the table to eat and then they leave.

Not the best kind of arrangement I know but this is keeping the peace according to my husband. During these visits I have been quite proud of myself for maintaining a "poker face" and keeping a neutral tone to my voice. K___ has tried a couple of things to incite me, mainly involving C___ but I haven't taken the bait. Last night she rang and asked to speak with me, I was rather shocked. Anyway we had a conversation about one of her girlfriends, blah blah, filling me in on the latest gossip, but it was like she needed to just talk to her Mum, a bit strange I thought. Maybe my recent attitude is starting to pay off… at least she knows I'm not buying any emotional blackmail where C___ is concerned.

1st question - Last Sunday I have asked her to pack up the 2 bedrooms and the bathroom her and C___ were using. She agreed she would come on Monday but we are at Thursday and nothing has been done. These rooms were all left in a damn mess (and I haven't touched them which is amazing for me), she has taken the fundamentals but left the rest behind and she hasn't slept in our house for 6 weeks. I want to give her an ultimatum - do it or I will, but if I do it everything goes in the bin. Should I follow through or is this going to cause more trouble than it’s worth?

2nd question - How do I approach her about taking responsibility for her actions? Prior to K___ leaving she ran up a $300.00 phone bill in one month, part of which was due to her "borrowing" my mobile phone. My phone went missing for a couple of weeks and I really thought I had lost it but mysteriously it turned up. I was furious with her at the time and we did have words especially when the bill turned up. She claimed she would be paying the account but she left home and there has been no further mention of it. My problem is I want to ask her for the money but L___ is dead set against me doing this. He does not want to make any waves and just wants me to chalk it up with all the rest. We bought her car and paid for the rental property along with settling quite a few of her debts, all up 10k plus in the past 1½ years. Even so, I know she has debt collection agencies chasing her right now for unpaid bills - the mail still comes to our house. I believe she needs to take responsibility for this excessive phone bill and this is a prime example of OUR over indulgence. After reading your book we've become excellent in this department over the years, I want to stop but her Dad can't see it.

3rd question - She wants me to do something so it's easier on her - I don't think so!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We have inherited K___'s 12 year old cat which she has left behind when she moved out. When she rang last night I notified her the cat needs to be taken to the Vet as its having trouble weeing and she is worried it will need to be put down and claims she can't do this. She will take the cat today to get it checked out but then burst into tears saying if the cat needs to be put down she will make a second appointment and I will have to take it as she couldn't possibly do it. This request from the "I'm an Adult Now", cruel as it sounds I just think she has to be the one to do this, not me. Either you're a grown up or you're not, after her past performance sprouting about this I'm not inclined to do anything that makes it easy on her.

Am I being too hard?

Sorry to be such a pain but with her not living here I feel I have little or no leverage, it's not like I can ground her or anything and I certainly don't get any support from her Dad at the moment. The situation has created a rather bad feeling between us, which is the first time in 27 years of marriage we're in discord. However I am taking your advice and trying to be positive just for me, the rest have to take care of themselves. I'm trying to transport myself beyond all these difficulties and I know everything will work itself out in the end. I am working really hard on getting rid of the resentment flu and I try to forgive myself a little more each day.

Any help you can offer with the above would be greatly appreciated. I can't change the past but I reckon I can have a fair old go at the future. I want to try and establish a relationship where we all get some peace but at the same time K___ needs to know there are boundaries, no matter how old you are.

Thanks for your time and all those positive messages - they do help.

Aussie Mum

`````````````````

Hi M.,

Re: I want to give her an ultimatum - do it or I will, but if I do it everything goes in the bin. Should I follow through or is this going to cause more trouble than it’s worth?

>>>>>>>>>> Excellent idea!!! A single father and member of Online Parent Support reported a similar situation recently …his daughter always left the bathroom a mess each morning. So he gave her one warning: “If this stuff (i.e., cosmetics, hair spray, etc.) is all over the place tomorrow morning, I’m throwing it away.” Well …she didn’t clean up after herself …so he put it all in the trash. Plus she has to purchase – with her own money – any items she needs replaced (funny how the counter tops have been reported to be tidy lately).

Re: My problem is I want to ask her for the money but L___ is dead set against me doing this. He does not want to make any waves and just wants me to chalk it up with all the rest.

>>>>>>>>>> I think it would set a good example to request that she be responsible this debt. But it’s more about setting a good example than it is about the money. So, require her to pay a few dollars a week (e.g., $5.00). It will take forever to get you paid back, but (a) you won’t be putting your daughter in a financial crunch and (b) you will be modeling for her that there are no more free handouts.

Re: Am I being too hard [cat issue]?

>>>>>>>>>> Maybe just a bit …this issue falls into a gray area. I’m not going to recommend one way or the other on this one. You go where your heart leads you. If I had to deal with this situation (and I’m not saying you should be like me), I would probably go ahead and deal with the cat for her.

Bottom line: You are greatly on track. Thanks for being a good student. Keep taking care of you (taking care of oneself is another good behavior to model for our children).

Mark Hutten, M.A.

 

==> My Out-of-Control Teen: Help for Parents