Mom Has a Hard Time "Letting Go"

Hi Mark, I am just into my first week of the course and would like your help in what to do at this point. I have emailed you prior to purchasing your manual about the fact that my son D___ (17 years old) has left home and I need to get him back in order to implement your suggestions and bring us back as a family. I don't know how to go about this. If it sounds as a threat, he will not return. Should I ask him to return for his own safety and our love for him, should I give him an option or tell him he must return. It has now been 6 weeks and I feel he is slipping further away from us. I have like many other of your subscribers, been to counselling and she suggested that hard love was the option and that David needs to return on his own accord and on our terms. But I can see that the longer I leave this that there is a less likely chance that he will ever return.

Just to fill you in a little more, D___ ran away back in Jan. and was gone for 8 days. We asked him to return, but once he had it seemed that D___ was set to do anything and everything to make sure that he gets kicked out. So my husband gave him an ultimatum; live in our house with our rules or get out. So he chose the latter, of course. I feel that my husband made a very bad decision at this point and that we will never get D___ back. He is getting too heavily involved into the heavy metal music culture and has started to get body piercing and wants tattoos, all the things that my husband forbid him to do at home. He has given up school even though he was a great student. Please let me know what I should do at this point, as you know I would not be asking if I wasn't so desperate and feeling so lonely and vulnerable in this situation. ~ S.T.

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Hi S.,

My first thought is: Your husband did the right thing. If your son were any younger, giving him the “all-or-nothing” ultimatum would not be appropriate. However, he’s an adult now – literally [although not legally recognized as one depending on what country you live in].

This will be no consolation to you at all - I’m sure, but bear in mind that “self-reliance” in key. If your son is out on his own, he is developing self-reliance. He is growing up quickly and learning how the real world operates. Although this is terribly painful and worrisome for you, the mother, this current situation is largely a positive one.

I don’t expect you to be able to shut your emotions off and somehow muster up the ability to see this dilemma through rosy lens. But what I would ask you to do is 3-fold:

1. Trust that this will work out for the best in the long run, and do not make yourself miserable in the meantime.

2. Acknowledge the reality that, even if he were to come home today, you would either have to go through all this parent-child conflict again, or simply let him be in charge.

3. Let him know that he is always welcome to come home to visit – and he is even welcome to return home to live, but only if he is willing to abide by a reasonable set of house rules.

This will be much more difficult for you than your husband. You and I both know that this is in God’s hands now.

My prayer for you today is: God grant S__ the ability to accept the things she cannot change, the courage to change the things she can – and the wisdom to know the difference. - The Serenity Prayer

Mark Hutten, M.A.

 

==> My Out-of-Control Teen: Help for Parents

What To Do When Your Mom Enables Your Defiant Daughter

Hi, I bought your e-book last weekend and found it really helpful. I knew what to do, just didn't know how to go about it. My question to you is about family members. My 13 year old daughter could be the cover girl for your book. So I implemented your plan and had to do the 3 day discipline almost immediately b/c she snuck out of the house. My mother, child's grandmother, feels sorry for her. Helping her clean her room, taking her to the mall, talking to her all the time, etc. I want to get a security system: my mom thinks it is a waste of money. I'm sure you know the whole scenario. Do I let their relationship just be that - their relationship, or do I insist my mom leave her alone? I know my mother means well, but I told her she is rewarding my daughter's behavior just by talking to her about it so much and giving her undeserved attention. I am a single mother with a 5 yr old son as well, and I need my mother’s help at times. I try not to involve her with things, but I don't really have anyone else to bounce things off of. What do?

Another quick question - when you say the child can earn back a day, or get off 3 day discipline - do you mean by doing chores …watching your brother …etc.? Thanks, K.

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Re: Do I let their relationship just be that - their relationship, or do I insist my mom leave her alone?

I see this is a bind for you. You need your mother’s help at times, but she is not contributing to the solution with respect to helping correct your daughter’s behavior.

I hope your mother understands that she needs to be on the same page with you; otherwise, you’ll make 2 steps forward and she’ll move you 3 steps back. Plus your daughter will be very successful at playing you against your mother and vice versa.

In this case, the best thing to do is to come up with a set of “discipline rules” that you and mother agree to – make it a contract, write it out, and both of you sign it. In this way, when your daughter does behavior “x” …you and your mother team-up to implement consequence “x” …does this make sense?

If your mother does not abide by the contract, then you may have to be assertive with her and set some firm boundaries (e.g., “when I discipline your granddaughter, you may NOT converse with her, help her with chores, take her to the mall, etc.”).

==> Bottom line: This is serious business, and you cannot afford to waste time spinning your wheels in the mud.

Re: Another quick question - when you say the child can earn back a day, or get off 3 day discipline - do you mean by doing chores …watching your brother …etc.?

Your daughter “earns” her way off discipline simply by not repeating the ‘offense’ (e.g., if she gets a consequence for sneaking out of the house, but does not sneak out during the 3-day-discipline, then she has completed successfully).

Mark Hutten, M.A.

 

==> My Out-of-Control Teen: Help for Parents

A Little Comedy Relief

The Pastrami Family lays down the law when it comes to parenting. Take notes!



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What's the Best Length of Time to Ground a Defiant Teenager?

Hi Mark- I have been reading through the online parent book listening to the audio & watching the video sections... I am finding it very useful and it makes a lot of sense. I am determined to make the changes. Just wondering if you can help clarify something for me please... The 3 day grounding was put in place on Sunday night...(due to my son not coming home for the entire weekend...)

--No Telephone

--No TV

--No Computer

--I have confiscated new shoes

--No Pocket Money

He smashed the mirror in his room, burnt his other shoes, cut up another pair, I basically said bad luck and we found another old pair for him to wear. Tuesday night he came home at 7.35 ( I have set the curfew @ 7pm) so I started the grounding again...

Yesterday he refused to go to school???? Last night he came home on time, asked numerous times about his shoes, then relaxed for a while, we ate dinner together, had a nice evening until he took my shoes and hid them... I got upset but I didn't lose my cool too much Thank God. At one point I threatened to call the police if he didn't return my shoes... I didn't call them and eventually found my shoes. I didn't realize till after reading the section about this situation this morning the best way to deal with it...

This morning he tried again going on about the shoes saying that he won't go to school until I return the shoes???? He asked for some money, I said no, he was angry and swore at me then he left the house...

He got pulled over by the police asking why he's not at school, they called me, I gave them his JJO's number, they took him to his Juvenile Justice Officer, she has strongly advised him to go to school....

Would you recommend that I extend the 3 day grounding until he attends school?

Kind regards

S.

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Hi S.,

When a parent wants her child to fulfill any particular obligation (in this case, going to school), she (a) makes it clear what is expected and (b) makes it clear what the consequence is for not following through with the expectation. 

 

If the child refuses to meet the expectation, the parent follows through with the consequence (in this case, grounding for 3 days with no privileges). However, the clock does NOT start until he walks into the school building -- but he’s grounded with no privileges in the meantime.

Here’s an example from another parent: Her expectation was for her son to mow the grass. He refused. So she implemented the 3-day-grounding, and the clock started as soon as he started mowing the grass (he was grounded with no privileges in the meantime). The son figured out that he could start the clock whenever he wanted. So he cranked up the mower and did his chore so he could go over to a friend’s house.

It’s important for the child to know that he has some control over the consequence (i.e., he gets to decide when the clock starts), and the longer he procrastinates in meeting the obligation, the longer he has no privileges.

 

NOTE: This approach falls on the juvenile brain a bit better than hearing that the 3-day-discipline has been extended by 2 weeks.

Mark Hutten, M.A.

==> Effective Disciplinary Techniques for Defiant Teens and Preteens

"He is not going to be able to drive..."

Mark,

Well, M______ we thought has been behaving better. We did have to take away driving privileges several times as a consequence, and I had to thwart his leaving with a friend once (he was confined to the house/yard), but for several days he was following our rules as far as we could tell. We had been told in June by A_______ Mom (the ex-girlfriend) that our son was not to contact her daughter in any way. We know they have still been together and talking to each other even though we told M______ we wanted the Mom to "OK" this and then we would have no problem with them seeing/talking to each other. He states "she will never call you".

In the interim, I put a blocker on his ex'es phone so no incoming calls come through, and he agreed to not contacting her for 2 weeks so he could be allowed to drive. Well, today, we found out that he lied. He was supposed to stay home and to be watching his little brother. Called and asked if his friend and two girls could come over (a new girl who seems very nice and her friend). We said OK but had to stay in the family room and his brother would be present and NO inappropriate behavior (only over for about 1 hr). Well, girls never came over. He had permission to drive to work later in the afternoon, which he did (I gave him the car keys when I came home.)

After he left for work, this new girl K_____ called for him. She was upset. She proceeded to tell me that M______, his ex-girlfiend and another girl met her at a local fast food restaurant near the Mall (with my 9 yr old present). K_____ got into the car. He was driving his buddy's car (the friend was at football) as the car M______ uses was parked and I had the keys, and he did not have permission to drive. We do not allow him to be driving another's vehicle and he is only allowed one passenger. This ex proceeded to assault K_____. She escaped from the car and walked/ran back to the Mall where she had been shopping. She feels she was "set up" as A_____ has been threatening to meet up with her to beat her up. My 9 yr old admitted that this assault did happen. He was crying when he admitted it as he was threatened by M______ not to tell. He further stated they drove home, and the other girl then took over driving the friend's car and the girls left. Now I'm waiting for M______ to come home from work to confront him about this.

Obviously, he is not going to be able to drive. He did sign a driving contract which is very strict. He will also be confined to the house/yard for a while. I would like to know your opinion on how long you feel is appropriate. Sometimes I feel that 3 days is not long enough, doesn't "hurt" enough as it only takes a few days (certainly only a week at the best) for him to be "consequenced" again. Also, he is supposed to watch the 9 yr old again on Thursday--would you trust him?

Just so you know, I am taking care of myself. I no longer feel trapped at home to make sure he is home--I'm letting him face consequences. Thanks for being there!

J.

__________

Hi J.,

Would I trust him? No. Trust is earned. He would have to earn my trust by following through with expectations. Then, and only then, is trust extended.

Re: length of consequence. If you go more than 7 days, he’ll forget what he’s being grounded for and the lesson will be lost. 3 days works best, because it gets the child “back in the game” as quickly as possible.

Think of it this way: When a basketball coach has a player that gets into a fight with a member of the other team, the coach doesn’t suspend his player for the season – he doesn’t even “bench” him for the entire game. Instead, he makes his player sit on the bench for only one quarter.

Why? Because not being able to play for one entire quarter feels like an eternity to that player. If he’s kept out of the game any longer than one quarter, resentment builds and his sense of devotion to the team wanes.

The idea behind disciplining a teen (whose brain is not fully developed yet, and who does not perceive the passage of time the same way as an adult) is to issue the consequence immediately (i.e., here and now), consistently (i.e., he gets a consequence EACH TIME he violates a house rule), and short-term.

You want him to get “back in the game” as soon as possible so he can, in a sense, make more mistakes -- this is how he learns, and this is how he finds ways to adjust his attitude and behavior.

Mark Hutten, M.A.

==> Effective Disciplinary Techniques for Defiant Teens and Preteens

When One Parent Sabotages the Other

"Mark, You mention that it is better to have a weaker discipline strategy from both parents than a stronger strategy from one, but what if one parent will not discipline the child and goes behind your back to replace items you have withdrawn. This parent encourages the child to lie and be deceitful as he practices these traits and encourages the child not to tell Mom. We are close to divorce, but both desire the best for the child, but we see the best very differently. Some of these difficulties are exaggerated by our ages - I am 57 and he is 78; our son is 12."

At one of our recent parenting seminars, one member worried aloud that she and her husband disagreed about how to raise and discipline their 13-year-old son. She pointed out that she and her husband came from different family backgrounds, so the examples they had grown up with were very different. She wondered if they could ever agree about child rearing, and she was concerned that their son was not be receiving consistent rules from both parents. "How can we begin to come to some agreement?" she asked.

Throughout the room, heads nodded. It can be a big problem -- joining two people who have been raised by very different methods and expecting them to be in harmony about how to raise their own children. When people are falling in love and considering marriage and families, they usually don't think to ask, "Are you a passive parent …an authoritarian … a neglectful parent …or assertive?”

One of the biggest sources of marital stress is disagreement about child rearing. And for children, major parental disagreement is a source of mixed messages and confusion that may undermine the attitudes, values, and behaviors parents hope to teach. Whatever the nature of the disagreement, it can have a significant impact on all family members and can lead to an erosion of parental authority, as children learn to play one parent against the other.

If the children are still young, parents have time to negotiate some agreement about the major aspects of child rearing:

1st- Sit down together and list the aspects of child rearing on which you DO agree (e.g., what goals do you have for your child, say by the time he is 15, and what values do you want him to learn?).

2nd- Identify the standards of behavior that you agree are realistic for your child's age.

3rd- List any strategies you both think are important (e.g., you may disagree about punishments, but you may agree that both parents should set an example of respect and honesty; you may agree that it's important to tell him you appreciate it when he does what you ask).

4th- After you've identified points of agreement, begin to list areas of disagreement. Talk openly, calmly and respectfully about what you each believe regarding how your child should be parented -- and where you learned those beliefs.

5th- Identify child-rearing sources to which you can turn, understanding that together, you may need to learn new strategies to replace the old ways that are a source of conflict.

6th- Agree to a regular time to check in with each other about how you're doing together as parents. Give new strategies a chance to take hold and give your child a chance to learn that mom and dad are working together. Do not expect your child's behavior to change immediately, just because you are trying a new mutually agreed upon tactic.

Mark Hutten, M.A.

 

==> My Out-of-Control Teen: Help for Parents

Disneyland Dad: The Fly In The Ointment

Hi Mark, This weekend K is grounded. He asked his father to take him to soccer and his father did. (while his father lives with us I am in many respects a single mother and my husband is not interested in joint parenting). In fact my husband actively works against me. Anyway, now K says he doesn't care if he is grounded - he will get his father to take him. His father will buy him another phone if I confiscate it again. The only option I see is to say that the grounding stands and he must start it again and until he serves his grounding I will not take him anywhere. I would appreciate any thoughts you may have. ~ V.

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Hi V.,

Re: The only option I see is to say that the grounding stands and he must start it again and until he serves his grounding I will not take him anywhere.

You hit the nail right on the the head. When a child is grounded, but Disneyland Dad (i.e., the fly in the ointment) undermines the consequence, then mom simply restarts the clock when the child returns home.

For example, mom says her child is grounded for 3 days with no computer privileges. Disney Dad shows up and takes the kid to the carnival and buys him 3 lbs. of cotton candy, 2 stuffed toys, and one foot-long hot dog. Kid returns home (totally over-indulged and sick to his stomach) ...the clock starts again as soon as he walks in the door.

Be sure to let your son know that HE is the one extending the time-frame when he leaves with dad prematurely -- not you.

Also bear in mind the a weaker parenting plan supported by both parents is much better than a stronger one supported by only one parent.

Mark Hutten, M.A.

 

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