Empty Nest Syndrome?

Hi Mark,

Recently I purchased your Ebook, and I can't help but think we're too late to do anything about our son.

We live in Australia and our son turns 18 in 3 weeks time, this is the legal age in Australia for accessing Alcohol etc.

He has left school and was going to Tafe studying computers (but dropped out). He has an older brother in the ARMY living in DARWIN, thousands of kilometers away. My marriage is very stable so he has/d 2 parents living with him. We always wanted to know where he was and what time he would be home, this always seemed too restricting to him.

In a nutshell, our Son has now left home (quit his job) to live with friends. The motivation behind this is to collect unemployment benefits from the government. (he can't do it under our roof because it's means tested, yes thats right the government splits up families this way!) Approximately a month ago he had a job delivering pizza's which used to fund his loan repayment to me ($1000 for his car) and petrol for his car to get to his job etc.

Then he started hanging around with some old school mates (buddies) and I can't help but think they brain washed him into quitting his job because he will be better of on benefits. Also most of these mates have lost their license for driving offences, and he taxis them around everywhere now. During one of these episodes my son got busted for curfew and no P Plate display so he too will lose his license soon.

We raised him to be a kind considerate responsible person, but most of this has gone out the window since meeting up with these old school mates. (Still kind and considerate(to his mates) but responsible has gone)

Currently he still isn't on benefits, because you have to say your parents are abusing you, to get benefits under the age of 18, and I don't think he can bring himself to tell this lie, as we've always loved and supported him.

We feel so helpless, we spent 17 years bringing him up to be independent and seek employment etc. and in the first 2 week hanging around with these friends they convinced him to ditch everything. (we can't help but thinking they are preying on his kind nature, because he's always running them somewhere in his car. When we suggest they may be using him, he says they pay him petrol money, and won't listen any further.)

He still comes home for the odd meal (we usually coax him, because we miss him and want to see how hes doing, but he has not slept here for a month.

At the beginning of all this he also split up with his girlfriend. I don't think he's emotionally mature enough for any of this stuff thats going on, everytime we try to speak to him about any of it he more or less blocks his ears, and storms off.

We are toughing it out not giving him any money, (hoping he will come home to survive), so he comes home and gets stuff to sell. It's only stuff he's has bought himself from his job and he sells it to get petrol and maka's money. He loves his driving and freedom.

We don't think he's doing drugs, however he has recently taken up smoking and drinking alcohol.

Our main concern is in 3 weeks he will be eligible for unemployment benefits living at another address(without having to lie about abuse). We are concerned that once he starts he will get stuck in a rut, and not be able to get out of it, like so many young ones do these days. Another concern is he may have the opportunity to apply for an apprenticeship this week, but we now have zero control over his wearabouts etc. and are afraid his so called mates may talk him out of it, so he can get benefits for nothing in 3 weeks.

He is a bright kid with lots of potential, in a way he seems to have given up on himself. He always struggled with school as he never was interested, however he can build a computer from parts and install all the necessary software etc. no problems.

We had him tested for adhd years ago it was negative, however reading your Ebook, I can answer yes to just about all questions, appart from violence. However it also seems to describe most teenagers to some degree. He's has had several jobs already and is a really likeable guy, he gets bored easily with the jobs however. We always made him do jobs for pocket money etc, as I was bought up fairly strictly I guess.

What do we do? We know where he's staying. Should we continue to tough it out, or go around and drag him out kicking and screaming, actually that would be hard he's 6 foot 2 and bigger than me :-) What other strategies are there to try to get him on the right path again. I get the feeling he thinks he was causing us some money problems, and this is helping us. (I don't know how he can't afford the car payments any more) I could sell the car as it's in my name and still half the money owing to me, but this will just enable his unemployment situation with a lack of transport. In fact he has suggested to sell the car, it wouldn't worry him. His attitude is "I'm living the life that I want to."

Sorry for the size of this Email, but in a way it only scrapes the surface.

Best Regards .... G.

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Hi G.,

It sounds like you may be experiencing Empty Nest Syndrome, which refers to feelings of depression, sadness, and/or grief experienced by moms & dads after teens come of age and leave their childhood homes. Women are more likely than men to be affected; often, when the nest is emptying, mothers are going through other significant life events as well, such as menopause or caring for elderly parents. Yet this doesn't mean that men are completely immune to Empty Nest Syndrome. Men can experience similar feelings of loss regarding the departure of their teens.

THOSE MOST AT RISK FOR THE EMPTY NEST:

1. Full-time parents.
2. Those who struggle with menopause, retirement, and aging parents.
3. Those who feel their child is not ready to leave home.
4. Those who have difficulty with separation and change.
5. Those who feel their child will be in “harm’s way” while out in the “real world.”

There are practical steps you can take to help you feel better:

• Buy some pay-as-you-go mobile phone vouchers or prepaid calling cards for your son so that keeping in contact is financially viable.

• Explore alternatives, such as spending some time with a relative or taking part in a supervised summer work project. Discuss other options, such as spending several weekends away instead of the same number of days in a row.

• Help you’re your plan his time away from home. This gives him the message that you have faith in his maturity—something most adolescents are desperate to hear. It also helps you ensure that his plans are reasonable and safe.

• Make care packages for your son with anything from groceries to a set of towels for his apartment (or wherever he resides). Try not to overdo it in the beginning, and don't attach any strings to the gifts.

• Renew close relationships, such as those with spouses, partners, other family members, and friends.

• Send your son brief e-mails of what's happening at home.

• Stay in close touch with the people your son will stay with. Explain any special concerns you may have. If the stay is for more than a few days, agree on ways to communicate regularly with your son.

• Time and energy that you directed toward your son can now be spent on different areas of your life. This might be an opportune time to explore or return to hobbies, leisure activities, or career pursuits. Realize that a loss can actually be a gain.

• Try to schedule a weekly chat on the phone.

• Lastly – let go. Remember that the more resistant you are to your son's emotional growth, the more of a struggle it will become. Some parents have a very difficult time giving their adolescents enough opportunities to make their own decisions. Being too restrictive can provoke the rebellious and possibly dangerous behaviors you're trying to avoid.

This marks a time to adjust to your new role in your son's life as well as changes in your identity as a parent. Your relationship with your son may become more peer-like, and you will have to get used to giving him his privacy.

Good luck,

Mark Hutten, M.A.

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Time-Outs for Kids: Ages 2-5

Time-out is a way of disciplining your youngster for misbehavior without raising your hand or your voice. Time-out involves removing your youngster from the good stuff in life, for a small amount of time, immediately following misbehavior. Time-out for kids is similar to penalties used for hockey players. 

When a hockey player has misbehaved on the ice, he is required to go to the penalty area for two minutes. The referee does not scream at, threaten, or hit the player. He merely blows the whistle and points to the penalty area. During the penalty time, the player is not allowed to play, only watch. Time-out bothers hockey players because they would rather play hockey than watch. Keep this hockey comparison in mind when using time-out for your youngster. 

Kids usually do not like time-out because they would rather play than watch other kids play. So when you use time-out in response to a misbehavior, remove your youngster from whatever he or she is doing and have him or her sit down.

Where should the time-out area be located?

You do not have to use the same location each time. Just make sure the location is convenient for you. For example, using a downstairs chair is inconvenient when the problem behavior occurs upstairs. An adult-sized chair works best, but a step, footstool, bench, or couch will also work. Make sure the area is well-lit and free from all dangerous objects. Also make sure your youngster cannot watch TV or play with toys.

How long should time-out last?

The upper limit should be one quiet minute for every year your youngster has been alive. So if you have a 2-year-old, aim for two quiet minutes. Keep in mind, kids do not like time-out, and they can be very public with their opinion. So it may take some time to get those two minutes. This is especially true in the beginning when kids do not know the rules and still cannot believe you are doing this to them. For some reason, the calmer you remain, the more upset they are likely to become. This is all part of the process. Discipline works best when you administer it calmly.

So, do not begin the time until your youngster is calm and quiet. If your youngster is crying or throwing a tantrum, it does not count toward the required time. If you start the time because your youngster is quiet but he or she starts to cry or tantrum, wait until your youngster is quiet again and then start the time over. Do not let your youngster leave time-out unless he or she is calm; your youngster must remain seated and be quiet to get out of time-out. Some programs suggest using timers. Timers can be helpful but are not necessary. If you use one, remember the timer is to remind moms & dads that time-out is over, not kids.

What counts as quiet time?

Generally, quiet time occurs when your youngster is not angry or upset, and is not yelling or crying. You must decide when your youngster is calm and quiet. Some kids get perfectly still and quiet while in they’re in time-out. Other kids find it hard to sit still and not talk. Fidgeting and “happy talk” should usually count as being calm and quiet. For example, if your son sings or talks softly to himself, that counts as quiet time. Some kids do what we call “dieseling,” which is the quiet sniffling that usually follows a tantrum. Since a “dieseling” youngster is usually trying to stop crying but cannot find the off switch, this also should be counted as quiet time.

What if the youngster leaves the chair before time is up?

Say nothing! Calmly (and physically) return your youngster to the chair. For kids who are 2 to 4 years old, unscheduled departures from the chair are a chronic problem early in the time-out process. Stay calm and keep returning the youngster to the chair. If you tire or become angry, invite your spouse (or any adult who is nearby) to assist you as a tag-team partner. If you are alone and become overly tired or angry, retreat with honor. But when help arrives or when your strength returns, set the stage for another time-out.

What if my youngster misbehaves in the chair?

Say nothing and ignore everything that is not dangerous to youngster, yourself, and the furniture. I repeat: Say nothing! What do I mean by nothing? I mean not anything, the absence of something, the empty set, the amount of money you have when you have spent it all, the result of two minus two or what zero equals. I mean nothing. Most of your youngster’s behavior in the chair is an attempt to get you to react and say something, anything. So expect the unexpected, especially if you are a nagger, screamer, explainer, warner, reasoner, or just a talker. And I mean the unexpected. They may spit up, wet, blow their nose on their clothes (you may be tempted to say “Yecch” but…do not), strip, throw things, make unkind comments about your parenting skills, or simply say they do not love you anymore. Do not worry. They will love you again when their time is up, believe me.

When should I use time-out?

When you first start, use it for only one or two problem behaviors. After your youngster has learned to “do” time-out, you can expand the list of problem behaviors. In general, problem behaviors fall into three categories: 1) anything dangerous to self or others; 2) defiance and/or noncompliance; and 3) obnoxious or bothersome behavior. Use time-out for “1” and “2” and ignore anything in category “3.” If you cannot ignore something, move it into category “2” by issuing a command (e.g., “Take the goldfish out of the toilet.”). Then if the youngster does not comply, you can use time-out for noncompliance. Be sure to use time-out as consistently as possible. For example, try to place your youngster in time-out each time a targeted behavior occurs. I realize you cannot be 100 percent consistent because it is in our nature to adapt. But be as consistent as you can.

In general, immediately following a problem behavior, tell your youngster what he or she did and take him or her to time-out. (With older kids, send them to time-out.) For example, you might say, “No hitting. Go to timeout.” Say this calmly and only once. Do not reason or give long explanations to your youngster. If your youngster does not go willingly, take him or her to time-out, using as little force as needed. For example, hold your daughter gently by the hand or wrist and walk to the time-out area. Or, carry her facing away from you (so that she does not confuse a hug and a trip to time-out). As I suggested earlier, avoid giving your youngster a lot of attention while he or she is being put in time-out. Do not argue with, threaten, or spank your youngster. And what should you say? Hint: Starts with “No”’ and ends with “thing.” Answer: Say nothing!

What do I do when time is up?

When the time-out period is over, ask your youngster, “Are you ready to get up?” Your youngster must answer yes in some way (or nod yes) before you give permission for him or her to get up. Do not talk about why the youngster went into time-out, how the youngster behaved while in time-out, or how you want your youngster to behave in the future. In other words, do not nag. If your youngster says “No,” answers in an angry tone of voice, or will not answer all, start time-out over again. If your youngster chooses to stay in the chair, fine. It is hard to cause real trouble in time-out.

What do I do when my youngster leaves the chair?

If you placed your youngster in time-out for not doing what you told him or her to do, repeat the instruction. This will help teach your youngster you mean business. It also gives your youngster a chance to behave in a way that is good for business. If he or she still does not obey the instruction, then place him or her in time-out again. In addition, add in a few other easy-to-follow, one-step commands. If he or she does them, praise the performance. If not, back to time-out. Generally, use this opportunity to train your youngster to follow your instructions when those instructions are delivered in a normal tone of voice without being repeated.

The general rule for ending time-out is to praise a good behavior. Once time-out is over, reward your youngster for the kinds of behaviors you want him or her to use. Catch them being good.

Should I explain the rules of time-out to my youngster?

Before using time-out, you should explain the rules to your youngster once. At a time when your youngster is not misbehaving, explain what time-out is (simply), which problem behaviors time-out will be used for, and how long time-out will last. Practice using time-out with your youngster before using the procedure. While practicing, remind your youngster you are “pretending” this time. They will still go “ballistic” when you do your first real time-outs, but you will be reassured that you have done your part to explain the fine print.

Summary—

1. Be specific and brief when you explain why your youngster must go to time-out.
2. Catch them being good.
3. Choose time-out areas.
4. Do not talk to or look at your youngster during time-out.
5. Explain time-out.
6. If you wanted your youngster to follow an instruction, give him or her another chance after time-out is over. And, in general, deliver a few other easy-to-follow commands so your youngster clearly learns who is in charge and who is not.
7. If your youngster gets up from the chair, return him or her to the chair with no talking.
8. Use time-out every time the problem behaviors occur.
9. Your youngster must answer yes politely when you ask, “Would you like to get up?”
10. Your youngster must be calm and quiet to leave time-out once time is up.

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He got upset and started doing bad things...

Hi K.,

I’ve responded throughout your email below:

Mark,

Last two days, my son was behaving well. It seems your methods are working the magic, for two days at least.

Tonight, my son didn't take care of bath room well and he floor was wet after his use. I asked him to wipe the floor. He shouted "later!" by which he meant he wanted to do his activity (has his mom take his picture in his new shorts) first. But I insisted that he wipe the floor first because I wanted to take the bath and he made the mess in the public area. He called my name with clear intention to ignore my order. I told him that if he does not wipe the floor in three minutes, he will not be allowed to access the computer for 24 hours.

Here, my wife questions whether this is the right thing to tell our son when he is upset and doesn't seem to understand what I am telling him. Would you agree?

Partially … see below—

After he calmed down a little bit, I talked to my wife in front of him, that she should not allow him to access her computer for 24 hours. At that late stage, he got up and tried to go to the bath room. I stopped him and told him that it is too late because he didn't do it within 3 minutes, and I already wiped the floor.

(Should I have allowed him to wipe the floor anyway and let the consequence away?)

Not necessarily…

He got upset and started doing bad things including scratching walls, throwing things, lightly punching me on my shoulder, name calling etc. I could ignore name calling, but what should I react to his punch? Should I let him punch me as long as it doesn't really hurt me?

No. Absolutely not!

Prevention Methods:

First of all, come up with a plan where your son takes a bath/shower without getting water all over the floor (e.g., “…put a towel on the floor before showering and stand on it when you get out”). This could save an argument from happening in the first place.

Second, when your son is calm, give him the following warning [with your best poker face]:

“If you choose to ignore a request to clean up after yourself, you will choose the consequence – I will do your chore for you and you will lose computer privileges for 24 hours. In the event you become physically violent, you will lose computer privileges for 3 days – and run the risk of having the police called because battery and destroying property is illegal.”


Re: Did I apply "When You Want Something From Your Kid" properly?

I’d say you are largely on track.

Keep up the good work,

Mark

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