Problems That Result From Over-Indulgent Parenting

Hi Sheila,

== > I’ve responded throughout your email below:

Dear Mark,

I followed your parenting programme and found it helpful, especially the poker face scenarios which worked to some degree. The problem has been that I have felt afraid to carry out some of the scenarios which you advise ie the 'take everything away and ground for 3 days' as my son is 17 and quite strong.

== > Unfortunately, not following the program’s goals will make it nearly impossible to be successful with the desired outcomes.

I think he has an addiction to the computer and he can be on it for up to 14 hours a day. As it is Summer holidays for him (but not for me) he has been on it until 4am in the morning and never goes out. This makes it very difficult for me to get a proper nights sleep because altho he is not noisy his moving around disturbs me and I get up the next morning to do a full days work feeling very tired. When I try to talk to him about it he says that I keep myself up.

When I came back from work 2 weeks ago (after a poor nights sleep) I had lots of work to do on my laptop and was very tired. He had not done the jobs he had agreed to do and there was a mound of washing up in the washing up bowl which was his. I was a bit annoyed (which he hates) but tried to get him to do the jobs there and then so that we could move on. He wanted a chinese take-away and wanted me to drive him to the top of the road to collect it. When I said no, that I had lots of work to do and I was tired but I would give him the money for him to get himself a take away when he had done his jobs he got really annoyed.

== > What did he do to earn money for Chinese take-away?!

To cut a long story short, we had a row, I was unable to maintain a poker face, I turned the computer off, which ruined the on line game he was playing, things went from bad to worse, he took my lap top from me. I tried to go to bed and said I was going to bed in a calm (but very tired) voice he turned the sound up on the computer - therefore I was unable to either work or sleep. I refused to leave his room until I got my lap top back …he started to drag me out of the room etc etc. to cut a long story short, he put a hole in the wall, pushed me over and turned his sound up again, he continued to throw things around the flat and break some of my things. - I called the cops. They took him to his father’s house for one night and that is the last I have seen of him.

== > I’m glad you called the cops. (I was beginning to wonder if you had any backbone.) You sent a very clear message to your son that violence against women is unacceptable.

It has taken 3 years of this to reach that scenario. I was at my wits end, I cannot seem to handle this on my own as he is too strong for me and NO-One has ever told him to stop. His father always says that I must be doing something to provoke him and will not talk to him and will Never agree with anything I say or back me up. He doesn't want to deal with it. Mediation services say he is crossing the boundary of 'normal teenager behaviour' and we need to talk to him. His father refuses to co-parent. In fact his father hates the cops so much and was furious I called them, that he now is forbidding me from seeing my son saying he needs protecting and he is to move in with him and threatening me with child protection and accusing me of abuse - but mark my son is 17 years old and 5ft 10, I am 5ft 4 and 54kg. I am the one with the bruises and although I have got into some tussles with my son, I have never used physical force to punish or control him!!! It is ludicrous.

== > It sounds like you have 2 teenagers to deal with – your son AND your husband. I’m sorry to hear that your husband is a jerk.

However this brings me to my final point and question…

I feel that my son will not learn a good lesson from this. He will, like his father, blame me and I have come to the point where I have been unhappy with him living with me for some time and cannot see a way forward if he came back.

== > This is where I thought we were going with this conversation – and I am glad to see that you are finally getting some insight into what YOU really need to do with this dilemma. I’ll read on…

I love my son desperately and miss him terribly, but there is some relief that he has gone, which I feel guilty about.

== > HOLD IT! Re: “feeling guilty”—

This is why you got so deep into this problem to begin with – that is, your “relationship” with your son was more important to you than it was to him; you took on WAY too much responsibility for that relationship. Of course you’ll always love him, but to AVOID setting healthy boundaries in order to protect your physical and mental health would be insane.

I feel at this moment in time I just dont want to see either him or his father for a very long time - because there will be too much anger from him that is not being addressed by him. Am I doing the right thing?

== > Absolutely! How does it feel to have an “awakening”?

I know you say never give up but I have tried everything under the sun from parenting classes to mediation and nothing works because I am the only one doing anything.

== > I don’t see your need for respite as “giving up” – rather, I see it as you finally realizing that if you don’t take care of you – nobody else will.

The other two just will not play ball... I have tried to be a good mum and things used to be wonderful but as my boy has got older there has been a lack of co-parenting and myself and his dad, have argued around him and have completely different ideas about parenting. He must be confused and there has been a lack of boundaries as we both say different things. I feel I just need to be out of the picture and hope some day that he might realise all the things I tried to do for him and the sacrifices I made.....Is there anything you could suggest that I could do or should I just leave it???

== > I’d leave it -- with one huge caveat:

When your son wants to come back to live with you because he and his father have had a meltdown, your temptation will be to welcome him with open arms. BUT, what you will be doing is setting the whole unfortunate thing in motion again.

You have described over-indulgent parenting on your part throughout this email. If you take your son back at some point – but continue to parent using an over-indulgent parenting style, your son will eat you for lunch …then spit you out.

Mark Hutten, M.A.

==> My Out-of-Control Teen: Help for Parents

The Important Distinction Between Punishment and Discipline

Mark- I am on week 3, and have found your online counseling a huge help to our family and situation. I hope that if we follow this, that we will see improvements with our 7-year-old daughter that has gotten out of control at home. She has been diagnosed ADHD and ODD. Every doc has recommended medications for her. Mainly I am sure because of school and the fact that she does have problems with socialization at school. She is aggressive with kids, but a friendly aggressive like hugs and such. She has a heart of gold, and wants to do good, but she doesn’t have the tools she needs in order to be constructive. You mention that we as parents should 'discipline' and not 'punish'. I am wondering what is the difference between discipline vs punishing? What I mean is, what is considered discipline and what is considered punishing? Thank you, J.

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Hi J.,

Discipline is: 

• "Time-outs" that are open-ended and governed by the child's readiness to gain self-control
• Acknowledging or rewarding efforts and good behavior
• Consistent, firm guidance
• Directed at the child's behavior, never the child
• Giving children positive alternatives
• Listening and modeling
• Logical consequences that are directly related to the misbehavior
• Physically and verbally non-violent
• Positive, respectful
• Re-directing and selectively "ignoring" minor misbehavior
• Reflection and verbal give-and-take communication
• Teaching children to internalize self-discipline
• Teaching empathy and healthy remorse by showing it
• Understanding individual abilities, needs, circumstances and developmental stages
• Using mistakes as learning opportunities
• When children follow rules because they are discussed and agreed upon
• When children must make restitution when their behavior negatively affects someone else

Punishment is:

 

• "Time-outs" that banish a child for a set amount of time governed by the adult
• Being told only what NOT to do
• Children are punished for hurting others, rather than shown how to make restitution
• Consequences that are unrelated and illogical to the misbehavior
• Constantly reprimanding children for minor infractions causing them to tune-out
• Controlling, shaming
• Criticizing the child, rather than the child's behavior
• Forcing children to comply with illogical rules "just because you said so"
• Inappropriate to the child’s developmental stage of life
• Individual circumstances, abilities and needs not taken into consideration
• Negative and disrespectful of the child
• Physically and verbally violent and aggressive
• Reacting to rather than responding to misbehavior
• Sarcastic
• Teaching children to be controlled by a source outside of themselves
• Teaching children to behave only when they will get caught doing otherwise
• When children follow rules because they are threatened or bribed

Discipline is when a lifelong lesson is taught, the person develops another part of their character and learns a lesson in something they can use for all kinds of situations in life. Punishment is when they just "get in trouble" - just get a consequence for an offense - but nothing was learned except maybe to not get caught or not make the person punishing mad.

Discipline is guidance. When we guide children toward positive behavior and learning, we are promoting a healthy attitude. Positive guidance encourages a child to think before he acts. Positive guidance promotes self-control. Different styles of discipline produce results that are different. Discipline requires thought, planning, and patience.

Punishment, on the other hand, is usually hitting, spanking, or any type of control behavior. Basically there are four kinds of punishment: 

• Penalizing the child with consequences that do not fit the crime: Example: "Because you told a lie, you can't have your allowance."
• Physical: Slapping, spanking, switching, paddling, using a belt or hair brush, and so on.
• With words: Shaming, ridiculing, or using cruel words.

Punishment is usually used because: 

• It vents adult frustration
• It's quick and easy
• Parents don't know other methods
• Punishment asserts adult power

Punishment does not promote self discipline. It only stops misbehavior for that moment. Punishment may fulfill a short-term goal, but it actually interferes with the accomplishment of your long-term goal of self control. 

The consequences for children include the following lessons:

 

• It is okay to hit people who are smaller than you are.
• It is right to hit those you are closest to.
• Those who love you the most are also those who hit you.
• Violence is okay when other things don't work.

Tips— 

• Address the situation; do not judge the child. This is important because diminished self-esteem leads to insecurity, even hostility.
• Be firm. Clearly and firmly state that the child does what needs to be done. Speak in a tone that lets your child know you mean what you say and you expect the child to do it. It doesn't mean yelling or threatening. Being firm works for any age child and for many situations.
• Be sure children know these limits. Be consistent.
• Build self-esteem and respect. Avoid words that reduce self-esteem.
• Guide through consequences. If a child leaves his toys outside and the toys are stolen or damaged--no toys.
• Keep discipline positive. Tell children what to do instead of what not to do.
• Keep your cool. Listen calmly to your child's explanation of the problem; talk about ways to deal with it. Come to a solution that's agreeable to you and the child--this helps the child learn to be responsible for his behavior.
• Plan ahead. Prevent misbehavior by eliminating situations that spell trouble. For example, make sure children have been fed and are rested before going to the grocery store.
• Set clear and safe limits.
• Teach by example. Be a good example. If you hit children for hitting others, they won't understand why they can't hit.
• When you discipline, explain why.

Sorry for all the bullet points. It makes it a bit impersonal, but also provides you with a digestible summary.

Thanks for the question,

Mark Hutten, M.A.

==> JOIN Online Parent Support

When you think your teen "may" have lied to you, but you have no proof:

Question

Hello Mark, I recently started your online program and am so glad I found it! I have a question involving lying that cannot be proven. I am 99% sure my 14 yr old son did these things but I have no physical proof that he specifically is the one that did it. My husband says without that proof we cannot punish him. I disagree, but I am afraid it may cause him to resent me on that 1% chance he is not lying. Issue 1: porn downloaded on my computer during 1 hour while I was away. I have a spyware program that showed this, and he says some app auto downloads stuff and he didn’t do it. Issue 2: 30 presc pills of mine are missing and he has been caught with other drugs/alcohol previously. Besides my husband and myself, the only person in the household is my 19 yr old daughter and we have no reason to believe she would have done either of these things as #1 she has her own computer, and #2 she has not had problems with this kind of thing, and #3 we can always tell if she lies and she says she didn't do these things. Should we punish my son? Thank you, T.

Answer

Your husband is right. If you don’t have proof, you shouldn’t issue a consequence – BUT you should safeguard your prescription meds and limit/monitor use of the computer.

As with ALL parents, there will come a time when you will catch your teen in a lie. It may be about something small, like telling you they have no homework when they are actually behind in school, or it could be something as big as saying they are spending the night at friends and staying out all night. When a teen gets away with a small lie, they tend to move onto bigger lies, so it's important to not let them get away with even the first small lie. It's about setting boundaries and using discipline to educate your child as to what you will not put up with, and drawing clear expectations of their behavior.

It's harder than it looks. You found out, you talked to them, you feel hurt and betrayed, but you pass it off as a youthful indiscretion and let it pass. They promise not to do it again, but the consequences did not match the action, and therefore they will continue to test and push to see how far they can get. Your job is to set clear expectations with your teen about lying, and set clear consequences.

This is a natural part of youth development, seeing how much they can get away with. But constant lying can lead to bigger problems, such as petty theft. So stay strong, set clear boundaries, and let the discipline (notice the word used here is discipline and not punishment) fit the lie.

How can you tell if your teen is lying to you in the first place? Listed below are a few ways therapists and other professionals use to spot when someone is telling a lie:

1. If your teen avoids looking at you when telling you a story or looks at you too long without blinking, this is an indication that he/she may be lying. People tend not to look at the person they are lying to in the eye when lying, unless they know this fact and then they tend to look at you for too long. If you talk to your teen on a regular basis, you'll see a deviation in how he/she behaves while communicating to you during a lie.

2. Many times when a person lies, they look down. When a person tells you what happened and it’s the truth, they tend to look up and ‘see’ the event happening as it did. But when someone is using their creativity to ‘make up’ what happened, they look down.

3. People who are lying fidget. But this is also a sign of stress, so don’t go by this alone. Ask to check up on the story.

4. People who are lying touch their face and mouth. This type of body language is something that happens often when someone is lying. It isn’t easy to pick up until you know to look for it.

5. Teens who are lying avoid details, or have well practiced details, and change the story in the second telling. Again, this doesn’t happen as often with highly intelligent teens. Ask to check up on the story and see how he she reacts.

6. The faster you get over the shock that your teen will lie to you, the better you will be at spotting when he/she is lying. Your teen will not be trying to hurt you by lying, so try not to emotionally attach yourself to that action.

7. There will be a pause. This one would tell me something is wrong when I had a teen on the phone. If I ask for details on what he/she was doing, there is always a pause before the answer. It’s time for the teen to make something up. This happens face to face too.

8. When someone lies, they get defensive and will not be happy if you chose to check-up on their story. It has been my experience when a teen is not lying, they offer ways for you to check up by giving you the phone numbers or names you need. They may be a little insulted – I fall back and regroup later – but they aren’t defensive. Being defensive and pitching a fit when asked to help you check the story is a sure sign something is amiss and the teen is lying.

Mark Hutten, M.A.

==> My Out-of-Control Teen: Help for Parents