A Little Drinking, Sex, and Curfew Violation

Dear Mark,I totally appreciate your e-book and study almost everyday. We are in the middle of the battle with a 17 year old daughter and we are staying above water. If you could help me with a few questions.

She has snuck out twice. The second time at her dad's where she thought she would not get caught. This time it was a little drinking, sex, and out the whole nig  This boy wants to marry and he is trouble. My daughter has always been very quite and made A's, B's in school …now, mostly C's and wants to live with him and his mother. They have no rules or structure in their home and he is constantly telling my daughter I am the enemy and I am horrible. When I get off track with how to react, I go back to the guidelines you have set up in your e-book and start over.

The question is this boy? We, her dad, step-dad and myself, do not want her seeing him and we want her to get back on track with studies and what she needs to do to head for college. Do you have anymore wisdom for me? We have been advised to get family counseling. My daughter does not want anything to do with it.  HELP! Ms. B.

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Hi Ms. B.,

You have a Romeo & Juliet phenomenon on your hands that will need to be diffused (if not, they will continue to work harder at sneaking their rendezvous behind your back).

Unfortunately, if your daughter wants to be with someone -- she'll find a way, no matter what you say or do. Parents can only guide their children in the right direction and hope for the best. If they do a good job, their daughter will make the right decision all on her own. 

 

Since you will not be successful at keeping those two apart, you must adopt a philosophy of if you can’t beat ‘em - join ‘em. In other words, they should be able to see one another within limits, and you decide what those limits are. Maybe your limits will look something like this:

· They can be together at your house only during those times that you are home and can monitor their behavior (if not, he has to leave)

· Or you could schedule some activity for them in which you would be a distant chaperon (e.g., take them to a shopping plaza and tell them to meet you back at the coffee shop in exactly one hour)

· Or your daughter is allowed to go over to her boyfriend’s house for a designated time period (if she violates the time limit, there is a consequence that is commensurate with the “crime”)

Figure out a way for your daughter to see her boyfriend in a way that will keep her safe. This is the best you will be able to do.

Mark

 

How much longer will you tolerate dishonesty and disrespect? How many more temper tantrums and arguments will you endure? Have you wasted a lot of time and energy trying to make your child change?  ==> If so, then this may be the most important article you'll ever read!

Are We Doing The Right Thing?

Mark,

Things had been going relatively well for approx. 3 weeks. I had e-mailed you re: some suspicious behavior, but couldn't prove it. I was feeling pretty good. Well, Thursday was the start on a backslide. He was asked to call me at work from landline phone as soon as he came home from lacrosse practice and to get something out for dinner. He was to take his last class of driving school (me transporting him) and then rush to his 9 yr old brothers baseball game. No phone call ever came. When I walked in, he was in his room, pretending to be napping (I think he was on his phone). Husband, me, 16 yr old got caught up in an argument re: this.

I ended up taking him (I had already NOT taken him twice before for behavior) since I am trying to hold up my end of the bargain, (husband was REALLY mad), made it back for most of the baseball game, and 16 yr old had to be off the phone early that night (this was suggested, not ordered, and was given freely 15 minutes early) AND lost cell phone until after school the next day. (I felt phone for phone was appropriate.) Friday was fine, went out, was where he said, and in by curfew.

Saturday afternoon, son and husband got into an argument over 16 yr old picking on 9 yr old and trying to take MP3 player away from him while he was listening to it (we are all in the car on the way to a b'day party). They got to swearing at each other, I got pulled into this and Dad telling me I was taking his side, I'm too easy, Blah, blah, blah. Dad ended up not going to the party. After several hours, 16 yr old's friend came to pick him up and they were going to the local fair. Friend was to drive him home by midnight. IF ANY plans were to change, he was to call me.

Curfew came and went, and no M______. I started calling, no answer. All of his friends were home and said the other one(s) was taking him home (they all drive). Find out, the kids ended up at a girl's house with no adults home--party time and at one point police were there. Was told my son was drinking. Told that night by this girl and another friend he was being brought home by someone I never heard of. Called the girl's house and was given the same story. Don't know the girl, or where she lives. Well, he never came home at all until 11:30am the next day. He never answered his phone--calling multiple times. 

==> Effective Disciplinary Techniques for Defiant Teens and Preteens
 

He came strolling in as if nothing was wrong. (His grandmother was also over as she was going to stay with our 9 yr old and we were going to this girl's house with police escort to see if our son was there. He came home before we could leave.)

We calmly (for the most part) told him we (parents) were the adults, it was our home, our rules, he was a minor child and must follow them like them or not. He must face the consequences of his actions: no cell phone, no phone privileges, no computer, and no going anywhere or having anyone over until further notice. I also did confiscate some of his favorite clothes. No driver's road test until later either since we could not trust him. If he chose to break these punishments, we would go to the police and file incorrigible charges. We would get back to him about length of time of grounding when we could think about it a little more.

We did tell him by Friday (this happened Sat. night) he could have his computer back if followed the grounding. I am entertaining letting him have "land line" phone for 30minutes/day to be used in the family room or kitchen also (if Dad agrees). If he follows these rules, he may be off grounding with approved friends/places the following weekend. There have been some hints at defiance, but he has mostly gone along with this.

He has said he was going to a soccer game on Tuesday but was told no and was at the school when I picked him up, he was going to have a friend call me to see if he could go out on Friday or would go anyway (told him no), and I believe he used our phone when we went to my 9 yr olds baseball game (no one home and can't prove this), and was trying to go out after school another day in the guise of "practice" the same day as a game, and told he would be picked up right after school and was there.

At times his mood is great, others not. I am trying SO HARD to not show my emotion in all of this, but my gut is doing flip-flops constantly and I haven't slept well in days. I want so badly for him to do the right thing.

I guess what I'm writing this LONG e-mail for is confirmation that what we're doing is the right thing. Is it appropriate? Is the length of time OK? We are telling him he can EARN back his privileges by his behavior. Is the testing us normal? How do you trust again after this? Would you still let him get his license? Thinking about getting a GPS if we do let him.

Thanks again for all of your support and wisdom. I just wish we had been more firm with him when he was younger, but we never saw this behavior coming.

J.

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Re: Is it appropriate? You are definitely ‘on track.” Good work.

Re: Is the length of time OK? Disciplines should never go longer than 7 days. If it goes longer than 7, the kid forgets what he is being disciplined for – and the lesson is lost.

Re: Is the testing us normal? Absolutely.

Re: How do you trust again after this? You don’t. Never believe a word he says. Verify everything. Assume that whatever comes out of his mouth is a lie. I know this sounds radical, but the bottom line is this: Lying is a way of life for intense, out of control kids. You have been deceived more than you’ll ever know.

Re: Would you still let him get his license? Yes. We want to foster the development of self-reliance – not dependency. If he has his license, he will not be dependent on others for transportation. I do understand that having a license could possibly lead to other problems in the future. In these cases, we have to weigh the advantages against the disadvantages. If he ABUSES driving privileges, he LOSES driving privileges -- but for no more than 7 days (3 days works best, and believe me -- 3 days will feel like an eternity to him).

Mark Hutten, M.A.

==> Effective Disciplinary Techniques for Defiant Teens and Preteens

What's Normal?

I was looking for a chart of normal behavior in young teens, do you know where I could access this. If as parents we don't know what normal behavior is for a 12 year old per say, then how can we judge them as being abnormal?

We have a son who seems to "need to control things" a huge amount of the time from everything to how he uses the toothpaste (dribbling it all over the sink wastefully) to how something should be done. He doesn't seem to be able to recognize he is doing this even when it is pointed out to him. He has to always end a conversation even when he is told to shut up repeatedly. He is even to the point where he mumbles to get in the last word. He is on concerta for add ...could the meds be doing this?

Thanks for any info.

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If you factor in (a) genetics, (b) environment and (c) personal choice -- you find a wide range of behavior that can fall into either the "normal" or "abnormal" category -- depending on who you are talking to. "Normal" is a relative term.

The little bit of behavior that you have described is slightly reminiscent of some obsessive-compulsive tendencies. I'd have to have more information to comment further.

p.s. Ideally, your son should not be told to 'shut up'.

Mark

www.MyOutOfControlTeen.com

Husband is a Skeptic .

Hi Mark,

I have written to you about my daughter. I have read your book and listened to the audio. I tried to get my husband to listen one night, we only got through a couple of chapters. We haven't had the time (or he hasn't mentioned it again), to finish it. I can tell he is a little skeptical of the techniques (picking battles and letting things "slide"). I have tried telling him what it is all about and he seems open to listening but like I said has not pursued listening to the rest of it.

Anyway, an argument broke out last night because of her attitude and being disrespectful to her stepbrother (his son). She ended up say the "F" word several times. This word has been "slipping" out of her mouth a lot lately. I have chosen to ignore it most of the time, she is usually yelling it as she walks away (which walking away is progress for her). He does not understand this and refuses to let her talk that way, he yells at her and makes threats. He told me last night he is just fed up and cannot and will not allow her to talk that way in his house. I don't think he understands why I blow it off and probably thinks I am not handling things the right way.

I have tried to put other techniques in to play and she seems to be responding a little, which is a good thing. She has controlled her anger for the most part during our arguments. I feel this is progress. I don’t' think he understands or thinks there is ANY progress going on.

How should I get him to have a more open mind to listen and understand the concept of this book?

Help!

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This problem comes up quite frequently (i.e., husband not really interested in doing anything differently). The best solution I found for this was actually not my idea at all.

One mother (going through the same problem as you) played the audio CDs of the eBook each time she and her husband were in the car together. I think she kinda brainwashed him a bit. You know ...the more you listen to something, the more you unconsciously start implementing what you heard.

This is a way for him to experience some of the material without having to really do anything (no reading, no sitting at the computer).

In the car, he's a captive audience. Give it a try.

You can get the CDs here ==> Audio CDs

Mark

Out of Control Teens

Hi Mark, I'm the step-father of two teenage boys, ages 17 and 15. Their mom and I have been married for 5 years. Both boys decided that they weren't interested in academics (duh) and began failing their classes. We pulled them from public school and put then into on-line school. Even with the reduced studying demands they continue to perform poorly. A___ routinely ignores his curfew and C___ has a significant problem with truthfulness. Both are in trouble with the authorities. I have 3 court dates this month alone. His mom and I have been working on the 3-day-grounding rule, but even that gets ignored. We need to have some sort of significant wake-up call that doesn't alienate them. I told their mom that a few days or months behind bars might be just what they need -- she's concerned that they'll just increase in their poor behavioral choices. Any suggestions? 

 

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Hi S., You’ve raised 5 issues: poor academic performance, curfew violation, lying, legal difficulties, and refusing to accept consequences. 1. Re: Poor academic performance—Please refer to my recommendation on the webpage entitled “Emails From Exasperated Parents” (online version of the eBook). 2. Re: Curfew violation—If your son is required to be home by a particular time and he does not come home, then he is considered to be a ‘runaway.’ File a ‘runaway complaint’ with police as well as juvenile probation. 3. Re: Lying—Please refer to “When Your Kid Lies” (online version of the eBook). 4. Re: Legal difficulties—I’m glad you are getting assistance from Juvenile Court. This will be a good thing. I’d rather your sons experience some mild, short-term pain now (in the form of probation) rather than a lot of major, long-term pain later (possibly in the form of adult jail – or worse yet, prison). 5. Re: Refusing to accept consequences—Again, if a child is unwilling to accept consequences for misbehavior, the parent has to be willing to enlist the help of an outsider (i.e., probation). 

 

Mark 

I am so fed up?

Hello mark-- Just a question of how to handle something!! My oldest daughter, who is 18, ready to graduate next week, I have wrote to you many times about, LOL!! …anyways, we went on vacation and she was left at home and I requested no parties at my house and no alcohol to be brought into the house. We got home yesterday and it is obvious that there was a party, empty containers, she says aren't hers and that she had a friend over that may have left it there? What should we do??? I am so fed up? P. 

 

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Unfortunately, you don’t have any evidence that she is NOT telling the truth. Thus, I don’t think you can legitimately issue a consequence. 

 

Mark 

F$%k You

Good afternoon Mark, I am a new addition to your website and have purchased and downloaded your information. I haven't read through the materials yet, but wanted to ask your opinion on the situation going on in my household. I am at a loss at what to do. My 17 year old son and I have always gotten along and he's always been very honest with me. Earlier this year he had started using marijuana, and had tried a handful of other drugs. He told me about this on his own. I told him I did not approve of his use, but appreciated his honesty with me. He and I have since had various conversations about his drug use, and my wish for him to stop. I have never punished him for what he has told me, because I thought that would result in him not telling me anything. Well, in late March he was caught at school with a very small amount of pot (I know, any amount is to much). He was suspended from school for three weeks. We got through that, and he's back at school - with the condition by the school that he see a counselor. Well - everything "seemed" to be going okay, although, he was spending more and more time with his friends. He'd go with them after school, but would always be home by curfew (10:00pm). Well, last Wednesday he had a counselor appt. in the evening. I called him to be sure he was going to be home in time for us to leave and he informed me he was not going. I told him it was not optional and we went back and forth, back and forth. I finally told him if he did not go, the consequence was loss of use of my car. He said he didn't care and then said 'f$%k you' to me, and hung up!! This came as a complete shock to me, as he and I had no conflict going on between us. I'm still not sure what I did to possibly be on the receiving end of that. After he hung up on me, I messaged him reminding him the consequence for disrespect was having his cell phone turned off (I've done this before - but not in months). His response was "if you want to be that way, good luck getting me to come home". Well, seeing that was the consequence of disrespect, I had his phone shut off. He called me later from his friends phone, just to say 'f$%k you" to me again. He did come home and then missed the bus both Thursday and Friday to school - so, I had to drive him....which made me late for work. When I asked him to please hurry, his response was 'f$%k you'. Thursday we drove in silence. Friday I tried talking to him - but it became an angry conversation. When he got out of my car, he slammed the door and threw his cup of coffee down the side of it. This morning, again, he would not get out of bed in time to catch the bus. After my fourth attempt to wake him, he said if I'd leave him the f#$$ alone, he would get up. So, I left him alone. The bus came and went. I decided I would not be late for work again, so, I left. As far as I know, he's still asleep. I'm at a loss. He has so much anger towards just me....but, I really have no clue why I've been singled out here. I know he is angry that I turned off the phone - but he seems to forget his actions caused that outcome. I don't know what caused his initial anger that resulted in the phone being turned off, now I don't know what to do to get past this. I'm afraid to talk to him, because he gets so angry. I don't want him to think he can walk all over me, so I will not turn the phone on until he and I can resolve this. How do other parents talk to their disrespectful teen when anger becomes an issue? He has both a father and stepfather - but both of them have washed their hands of him. I have not washed my hands of him and never will - but feel very much like a single parent here. Any advice and/or input to my situation would be GREATLY appreciated. Thank you so much for your time (sorry this is so long!), D. 

 

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Hi D., I need you to do me a really big favor! Since you are a new member of Online Parent Support—and since most of what you’re going through is addressed in the eBook, would you be willing to digest most of the material (read as well as listen), and then email me again with a specific question. Please pay particular attention to the Anger Management chapter of the ONLINE version of the eBook. I think that chapter will be the most relevant to your case at this point. Thank you. I’ll wait to hear back. 

 

Mark